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Virginia "Nina" Prosdocimi

Virginia "Nina" Prosdocimi

Female 1880 - 1959  (78 years)

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  • Name Virginia Prosdocimi 
    Nickname Nina 
    Born 25 Dec 1880  North Quay, Brisbane, QLD, Australia Find all individuals with events at this location  [1
    • Aged 24 when married, giving birth year of 1884
    Gender Female 
    Registration 1930  207 Keppel St, Bathurst, NSW, Australia Find all individuals with events at this location  [2
    Registration 1936  20 Carabella St, Kirribilli, Sydney, NSW, Australia Find all individuals with events at this location  [3
    Died 2 Oct 1959  Canberra, ACT, Australia Find all individuals with events at this location 
    Notes 
    • Julia Rosinia or Virginia? - Who is the real Nina?

      Nina Prosdocimi aged 24, a Queensland girl, married Charles Royes Luther aged 32 on 24 November 1908 at St Paul’s Church, Waverley. Charles was a grandson of Friedrich Christian Luther and Maria Royes (sister of Emily) … but who was Nina? Well she was the daughter of Giovanni Prosdocimi and Johanna Wernegreen, both of Brisbane. Beyond that, apparent confusion.

      Many Luther genealogies on the web give Nina’s Birth name as ‘Julia Rosinia’ with Nina assumed to be some diminuative (of Rosinia, I guess). This is understandable. A search of the Queensland BD&M site discloses only two Prosdocimi children – Maria (b.13-8-1878) and Julia Rosinia (b.8-2-1884). Nina’s age on her marriage certificate would have her born in 1884. SO, Nina is Julia Rosinia! QED!

      Unfortunately, things aren’t quite so simple. A search for Prosdocimi births allowing for inexact name matches reveals a third child – Virginia (b.25-12-1880). Virginia may be a better candidate for the diminutive ‘Nina’….but the birth dates don’t correlate. Nina was my great-aunt and the complication is that my family (including second cousins) are adamant that Nina is Virginia. They know nothing of a Julia.

      A further search of the BD&Ms reveals the death of a Dorothy Mary Prosdocimi in 1895. The girl was 11 when she died and so was born in 1884 – the same as Julia Rosinia. She also had the same parents as the other girls. Perhaps Dorothy was Julia! It would explain why there is no record of her in the family history I have access to.

      But, how was it that Nina (assumed) Julia’s age on the marriage certificate? The short answer is we don’t know. We do know that Nina was not ‘tied to’ her year of birth. Nina was the informant for her father’s death certificate (1916) and gave her age as 28 when she was actually 35. [and Julia would have been 31.]

      Marriages in NSW were then covered by the Marriage Act 1899 (NSW). That Act only required a celebrant to ensure that the parties were 21 years old or more – no ‘official’ documentation had to be produced to prove age. In Nina’s case, she was clearly over 21 and so she was taken at her word as to her age.

      Conclusion: Virginia is Nina and Julia died in 1895. Don’t settle for awkward matches. Allow inexact name matches when searching records - remember transcribing names from a handwritten register to a computer record is not an exact science..

      For those skeptical about such a conclusion I refer them to xxxxxxxxxx where I discuss the issue more fully.

      John Richardson [4]
    Person ID I5418  Roy~Royes | Hougham, Luther-Royes, Mordaunt, Royes
    Last Modified 21 Aug 2018 

    Father Giovanni Prosdocimi
              b. 1843, Roviglio, Venice, Italy Find all individuals with events at this location
              d. 18 Jun 1916, Mater Hospital, North Sydney, NSW, Australia Find all individuals with events at this location  (Age 73 years) 
    Mother Johanna Christiania "Annie" Wernegreen
              b. Abt 1853, Skieve, Denmark Find all individuals with events at this location
              d. 22 Oct 1889, Brisbane, QLD, Australia Find all individuals with events at this location  (Age ~ 36 years) 
    Family ID F4538  Group Sheet  |  Family Chart

    Family Charles Royes Luther
              b. 15 Nov 1876, Vale of Avoca, Hartley, NSW, Australia Find all individuals with events at this location
              d. 29 Jul 1957, Oberon, NSW, Australia Find all individuals with events at this location  (Age 80 years) 
    Married 24 Nov 1908  Canterbury, Sydney, NSW, Australia Find all individuals with events at this location  [5
    • Charles age 32, Nina's age 24
    Children 
     1. Carl R Luther
              b. 1909, St Leonards, Sydney, NSW, Australia Find all individuals with events at this location
              d. 1909, St Leonards, Sydney, NSW, Australia Find all individuals with events at this location  (Age 0 years)
    +2. Margarita Royes "Rita, Dickie" Luther
              b. 1910, St Leonards, Sydney, NSW, Australia Find all individuals with events at this location
              d. 2 Oct 1969, Canberra, ACT, Australia Find all individuals with events at this location  (Age 59 years)
    +3. Clive Prosdocimi Luther
              b. 20 May 1914, Sydney, NSW, Australia Find all individuals with events at this location
              d. 16 Dec 1943, Stompetoren, North Holland, Netherlands Find all individuals with events at this location  (Age 29 years)
     4. Ralph Godfrey Luther
              b. 1916, St Leonards, Sydney, NSW, Australia Find all individuals with events at this location
              d. Abt 2008, Bathurst, NSW, Australia Find all individuals with events at this location  (Age 92 years)
    Last Modified 20 Aug 2018 02:23:05 
    Family ID F448  Group Sheet  |  Family Chart

  • Event Map
    Link to Google MapsBorn - 25 Dec 1880 - North Quay, Brisbane, QLD, Australia Link to Google Earth
    Link to Google MapsMarried - 24 Nov 1908 - Canterbury, Sydney, NSW, Australia Link to Google Earth
    Link to Google MapsRegistration - 1930 - 207 Keppel St, Bathurst, NSW, Australia Link to Google Earth
    Link to Google MapsRegistration - home duties - with son Clive - 1936 - 20 Carabella St, Kirribilli, Sydney, NSW, Australia Link to Google Earth
    Link to Google MapsDied - 2 Oct 1959 - Canberra, ACT, Australia Link to Google Earth
     = Link to Google Earth 
    Pin Legend  : Address       : Location       : City/Town       : County/Shire       : State/Province       : Country       : Not Set

  • Photos
    Nina (Prosdicimi) Royes
    Nina (Prosdicimi) Royes

    Histories
    The Prosdocimi Conundrum
    The Prosdocimi Conundrum
    Nina:- Julia Rosinia or Virginia?

  • Sources 
    1. [S128] Correspondence re: Luther, John Richardson, John Richardson 20 Aug 2018.
      Birth registration 1881/B27191

    2. [S12] Australian Electoral Rolls 1901-1980, Ancestry.com.

    3. [S12] Australian Electoral Rolls 1901-1980, Ancestry.com, NSW>1936>North Sydney>Milson's Point.

    4. [S128] Correspondence re: Luther, John Richardson, John Richardson .

    5. [S307] Australia Marriage Index, 1788-1949, (Ancestry.com).